Clutchless

After commenting on a thread about clutchless upshift I was wondering how many of you guys actually use this and also find it usefull?

It usually seems normal for a split decision with the arguments for & against, personally I prefer it for a number of reasons

I used to most of the time until this year i find myself using the clutch more often.

I'm clutchless both upward and downshifting (oops changing gears in both directions).

Have sometimes wondered why I do it, but think it dates back to my shaft drive days. I remember a pillion asking if the bike was an automatic because she had never been on a bike that had such great gear changes

SteveCat wrote:I remember a pillion asking if the bike was an automatic because she had never been on a bike that had such great gear changes

Thats exactly the reason I use it Steve, You are brave using it on downshift

I only use the clutch for upshifting when pottering around town between 1st and 2nd.
Find it a heck of a lot smoother and quicker when riding along normally to upshift without the clutch.

Always use it for downshifting!! If you dont time it right on the downshift the gearbox tends not to like it too much, and i usually feather the clutch out on downshifting as the duc easily spins the back wheel if you dont...Ideally a slipper clutch would be the answer but man they are an expensive add on for my bike.

Changing down might be a bit trickier, but its really the same technique, get the revs and speed right.

The bikes nearly 100 (thou kilo's that is)and not really any bad effects from my bad riding style. I do use the clutch around neutral though, Yams have always had a clunky gear box, especially 1st to 2nd and more so in reverse.

DBD - you should have gone for the Ninja! Slipper clutch is standard. Mind you have to be unkind or needing to scrub off some speed before you find it working.

As to gear changes; once I mastered the clutchless change I wouldn't want to go back. You can keep the acceleration almost linear if you hit all the timings correctly.

Changing down - too afraid to mangle the gearbox so invariably I use the clutch. Although it has happened once or twice by accident

greencat wrote:you should have gone for the Ninja! Slipper clutch is standard.

Stop tempting me Chris

DBD - you should have gone for the Ninja!

That black ninja is one of the best looking bikes around still,in my opinion, but im kinda hooked on V twins now.
Really need to get something more sensible but cant bring myself to part with it.

I have mistaken this for an underwear thread (so to speak) but since I'm here now I'll put my tuppence in.

Up until last years Spain trip I'd never used clutchless changes.
The rest of the gang enlightened me.
I practiced the whole holiday and try to use when I remember.
It's probably cause I've not mastered it yet but I can always get smooth changes with the clutch and struggle to match this without the clutch.

Can't bear to down change without clutch. It just feels too unkind to some part of the bike.

I should maybe add that I didn't know where to put my feet until after wrecking my boots at Cadwell (was that just last year??). I thought I was wearing down my toe sliders.....nope another few mm and it was a real toe sliding!!!

Cheers
Rosco

I have mistaken this for an underwear thread

Should have gone to specsavers... [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

The only time I use clucthless is when carrying a pillion with me

To be fair I haven't really mastered it yet though so I sometimes use the clutch still

I do it occasionally - usually without meaning to and i then find myself apologizing out loud to Ezzy after!

I had an ex-racer mate tell me about clutchless changing. I find that it's OK between 3-4 4-5 and 5-6, but I tend to find false neutrals, or just plan neutral if I use it on 1-2 or 2-3.

I also found that when I'm pushing harder this happens more frequently.

So now if I'm intending to ride fast I usually do a half clutch and a little dip in the throttle as I apply pressure with my foot.

It's nice when it works, but when it goes wrong it really isn't much fun at all.

I tend to find false neutrals, or just plan neutral if I use it on 1-2 or 2-3.

I found that when i first started doing clutchless changes.
ya just gotta make sure you give the lever a good kick when accelerating hard!!

I assumed there was a knack to it. I get almost a double-click sometimes. I suspect some gearbox shaggage so intend to take it easy for a bit.

Try adjusting the lever down a bit so it sits closer to your toe.
That worked for me!!

I love the feeling of clutchless when accelerating hard, Its so smooth & effortless,
It takes a little practice to master but is worth persevering with, Its not easy to explain but its about the right amount of pressure on the gear lever combined with throttle/revs :rite:

Can you guys advise me on where to start with clutchless upshifting. I want to try it but I am worried about the long-term effects on the gearbox. Is there a particular rev range to do this in and I presume I don't close the throttle at all?

Regards,

Sam.

I don't use the clutch when going up but almost always do when going down the gears. I may be doing it wrong but I don't have the throttle pinned open when I kick it up but allow for a really small release, literally a millisecond and it has always fallen into place. Not keen on trying it gearing down, for some reason I have it on my head that it could be damaging...

My 'layman' knowledge goes as far as this.

Don't try and time applying upwards pressure on the gear pedal with your (off/on) of the throttle.
Apply pressure on the gear pedal and keep it there until you are in the gear you want to be in.
The (off/on) doesn't have to be massive but if it is not enough then you won't change.

I use this method when I remember but still find that more often than not I'm smoother with the clutch.
Not sure if this means I'm rubbish at clutchless changes in which case you might want to disregard what I've or I'm a wizard with the clutch.

One other thing......Obviously the gear lever keeps moving up so you to apply the same pressure you need to keep lifting your toe. Something you probably don't notice (well I didn't) if you always use the clutch.

I do stress that I'm no expert and will sit or stand to be corrected
.
I'm sure you'll know when you've got it sussed.

Cheers
Rosco

Can you guys advise me on where to start with clutchless upshifting.

When you want to upshift keep a good pressure up on the gear lever with your toe and quickly blip the throttle off and back on ( just as fast as you can say C@nt) and the gearchange will slot in nicely. you wont damage the gearbox, but you might get a few false neutrals until you get more used to doing it. Revs dont matter.
Once you get used to it you'll be doing it all the time, much smoother change and quicker.
As i said before i always use the clutch on downshifting but you can do it clutchless if you get the revs right.
Now get out there and get it done!
(Im no expert either but thats how i do it and it works for me)

Thanks for the tips and sorry to hijack the thread. I'll give it a go this afternoon!

Yep, same for me as the others have explained.

Be aware that its easy to lock the rear wheel when downshifting clutchless especially in the wet

How did you get on Pipersam?

Never heard or tried this (unless the cable had broken) before.

Tried it this morning to work, upshifting only, and found it to be okay. I only did it above 2nd though.

Is this the reason why on the GP the clutch never, seems, to be used? I thought the had some auto box or clutchless one like the GP cars!

DOH!

You learn sumfink new every day!